SYMBIAN OS SECTION
  -My-Symbian.com-
MAEMO  SECTION
-My-Maemo.com-
MEEGO  SECTION
-My-MeeGo.com-
SOFTWARE STORECONTACT


My-Symbian.com Forums

 
My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo
Symbian & Linux based Communicator and Smartphone Info Center
The Oldest Symbian Community Website - Since 1999
 
 Watched TopicsWatched Topics   FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RulesRules   Log inLog in 
Lightweight, simplified version of the forumsMobile version
Sailfish OS SDK now available

Go to page
Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo Forum Index -> Jolla Sailfish OS
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Wednesday, 30.Oct.2013 22:22    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

It is a huge step forwared for cross compiling Qt sources on mobile platforms (ios, android, sailfish,...)

Both Qt5 and QtQuick 2.0 definitely are a HUGE step forward. No question about it. So in that regard choosing Qt5.x instead of Qt4.8 surely was much more 'futuristic'.

It's just that it slowed down / delayed many things. I guess that the delays with SDK updates were caused by that. And now we still have that module mess, which is quite troublesome for all developers who do not directly/continuously monitor Qt5.2 development and thus don't know what went where, what was renamed, replaced, etc. Normally it wouldn't be that important, but directly before the Sailfish OS' launch it further complicates things...

So maybe supporting both Qt5 and Qt4.8 (at least initially) would have been a better choice, which might have resulted in much more applications being ready for the Jolla at its launch....

Anyway, the choice had been made and nothing will change it. So what's needed now - as I wrote earlier - is GOOD DOCUMENTATION so that every new developer willing to start making apps for Sailfish OS can quickly find all the required information rather than spend days on looking up every single missing bit of information. Adding the missing QtPositioning itself took 15 minutes, but prior to that it took 2-3 days to find all the required information (i.e. that Positioning has been moved from QtLocation to QtPositioning, that QtPositioning is not included in the SDK, how to add it, and so on). A simple guide would have saved me and everyone else (and positioning is such a popular function that almost everyone uses it) at least several days of completely wasted time...

And the second thing is availability of developer units. It's really the high time to start providing them if they want to have even just a symbolic number of native applications ready at phone's launch. In its current form the emulator is OK for testing the code, the UI, etc., but it doesn't allow testing anything related to sensors, GPS, camera, and many other hardware components. Even if modules like QtPositioning are also missing on the actual device (on the ARM target), now I know how to add them so it won't be a problem - either I'll manually install them on the phone or I'll include them as dependencies in the .rpm.

Finally, with The Other Half being Jolla's unique innovation and one of its key features, I guess it's the high time to publish detailed documentation covering it (both the electrical/electronical specification and development information on how to control it from within Qt/QML) so that people can start working on REAL applications of it rather than just (very nice but fairly useless) pictures illustrating some very interesting ideas.
Back to top
Casanunda
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 01 Dec 2009

Posts: 438

Thanks received:
52 in 48 posts
Thanks given: 323


Phone: n900, Jolla

PostPosted: Wednesday, 30.Oct.2013 23:19    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

I think the reason for switching to Qt5 was that - for whatever reason - they switched to another chipset that doesn't seem to have native driver support.
This means they have to use libhybris to use Android drivers, which in turn means they have to use wayland, which is properly supported only in Qt5 and not in Qt4.8.

I suppose there was some kind of problem with the initially planned chipset.
That will not have made it easier for Jolla...

Somewhere I read a statement by a Jolla employee that libhybris is used for basically all drivers on the Jolla Phone.
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Thursday, 31.Oct.2013 03:28    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

That makes a lot of sense.... But it didn't have to be caused by chipset problems, maybe they purposely decided to use Android drivers to allow for easier portability of Sailfish OS in the future. I think they hope that someone might be willing to license Sailfish OS in the future and support for (so common these days) Android hardware would be of great help in such case.

Quote:

Somewhere I read a statement by a Jolla employee that libhybris is used for basically all drivers on the Jolla Phone.

Right. They officially announced both software and hardware Android compliance.
Back to top
Casanunda
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 01 Dec 2009

Posts: 438

Thanks received:
52 in 48 posts
Thanks given: 323


Phone: n900, Jolla

PostPosted: Thursday, 31.Oct.2013 09:15    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

Right. They officially announced both software and hardware Android compliance.


They did, but at first I thought that their first own device uses own drivers - and Android hardware compatibility was made for 3rd party OEMs.

But you are right, if they want to convince other companies that it's easy to use Sailfish on their "Standard" Android platforms, easiest way is to show they are doing the same thing on their very own device.
Back to top
detten
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 25 Jan 2012

Posts: 87

Thanks received:
16 in 15 posts
Thanks given: 5


Phone: N9

PostPosted: Thursday, 31.Oct.2013 09:38    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

So what's needed now - as I wrote earlier - is GOOD DOCUMENTATION so that every new developer willing to start making apps for Sailfish OS can quickly find all the required information rather than spend days on looking up every single missing bit of information


At least they are trying to centralize the various documentation links :
https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Porting/Harmattan
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Friday, 01.Nov.2013 17:29    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

At least they are trying to centralize the various documentation links :
https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Porting/Harmattan

Yes, I've seen it. But try and find anything about QtPositioning or QtLocation there Wink It's not mentioned anywhere, as if it didn't exist. For instance, the main "Similarities and differences between Harmattan and Sailfish" table lists QtSensors, QtMultimedia, QtFeedback, QtSystemInfo..... but NOT QtPositioning or QtLocation. And this is very strange because - as I wrote - positioning is one of the most frequently used functions on a smartphone these days, so I guess that almost everyone will need to use it when porting his apps from Harmattan or Symbian, and thus everyone probably ends up just like me - spending a couple of days on finding the required information.

Another thing is that many pages (including some linked from there) were created in early 2013 and still haven't been updated, thus still covering the Qt4.8 / QtQuick 1.1 based Silica.

And - as I wrote - there's still almost nothing related to packaging, especially the role and structure of the .yaml file. If some modules still aren't included by default when the phone starts shipping and thus need to be included as dependencies in the .rpm file, proper documentation of it will be a must.

All in all, documentation badly needs to be quickly updated and completed.
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Sunday, 03.Nov.2013 14:32    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

The spec file is documented here:
http://www.rpm.org/max-rpm/s1-rpm-build-creating-spec-file.html(exampl e, overview)
http://www.rpm.org/max-rpm/ch-rpm-inside.html(detailed)
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Monday, 04.Nov.2013 08:36    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Thank you, Ketlik.

I've recently learned, however, that the .spec file is of lesser importance than .yaml, as the .spec file actually gets automatically generated based on the .yaml file. In other words, if you make changes to the .yaml file then they will be preserved and will be also automatically reflected in the .spec file. So it is the .yaml file that should be modified, not the .spec file, as written e.g. here:

https://lists.sailfishos.org/pipermail/devel/2013-October/000909.html

The .yaml file contains several important sections, like e.g. PkBR and PkConfigBR, where dependencies should be added.

Unfortunately, there is still no documentation for the .yaml file. Jarko Vihriala from Jolla wrote on the Sailfish OS mailinglist that they're planning to add it in one of upcoming SDK updates, so let's hope it won't take long.

----

On a different note, so far I fully ported to Sailfish OS two of my applications and now working on the third. I'm doing it all for the second time (previously to Qt4.8/QtQuick1.1/FWVGA, and now to Qt5/QtQuick2.0/qHD). Due to minor undocumented differences (or maybe documented, but God knows where) it usually takes about 2-3 days to port an application, as you need to spend time on finding out what and why doesn't work or works differently than expected.

If there are no other unexpected difficulties with the remaining apps, I should have all my applications fully ported to Sailfish OS within less than two weeks. That's of course without testing if things like sensors, GPS receiver, etc. really work OK, as it cannot be tested with the emulator.

I've also ported to Sailfish OS (for use within my applications) some components which were present on Harmattan but they're missing on Silica, like e.g. InfoBanner and Tumbler.
Back to top
spyder81
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 14 Feb 2013

Posts: 101

Thanks received:
17 in 12 posts
Thanks given: 20


Phone: 31648778428

PostPosted: Monday, 04.Nov.2013 21:10    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Michal, what do you think about the Blackberry-Fairfax deal? Thorsten Heins leaves and Chen is the new interim CEO. I hope that Blackberry can survive and get some marketshare. BB10 is really a good OS and deserves to be continued.
Back to top
Casanunda
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 01 Dec 2009

Posts: 438

Thanks received:
52 in 48 posts
Thanks given: 323


Phone: n900, Jolla

PostPosted: Tuesday, 05.Nov.2013 16:51    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Something for people with a "spare" N9 and fun in trying new things:
Installing SDK version of Sailfish UI on N9

That is of course a proof-of-concept only: it it will install Sailfish SDK version (not complete OS!!) on top of Nemo Mobile running on N9 or N950.

Anyone willing to try?


(link found through unofficial "Jolla Mobile" facebook link).
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Friday, 13.Dec.2013 23:56    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

https://lists.sailfishos.org/pipermail/devel/2013-December/001724.html wrote:

Installer:
* Setting the additional application source folder now actually works. This setting can be used to specify a project location that is outside of your home directory.

SailfishOS SDK IDE:
* Qt Creator updated to version 2.8.1-3
* Qt Creator uses new wizard to create Mer ARM device, device creation is described on https://sailfishos.org/develop-firstapp-article.html in section 'Create a connection to Mer ARM device'
* Shadow building is supported, you can now safely build applications for both architectures without them clashing.
* Shadow building is on by default for each new project, but can be turned off in project's settings.
* Latest SDK Application template is integrated so Harbour application requirements can be more easily fulfilled.
* User settings are now stored in a new directory (Linux/OSX: $HOME/.config/SailfishAlpha3, Windows:C:\users\username\AppData\Roaming\SailfishAlpha3) so deleting old settings directory is not mandatory.

Templates/examples/tutorials
* Templates are updated with the latest SDK Application template.
* Quite a few Qt5 tutorial applications were ported to Sailfish OS, they can be found from ~/SailfishOS/tutorials and they can be used to study Sailfish OS application behaviour. Each tutorial's project directory has a README.md file which contains notes from a developer when porting the application from Desktop QML to Sailfish OS. Some of the notes might be outdated.

SDK Maintenance Tool:
* Installer version updated to 1.4.0-2.

Documentation:
* Documentation is updated with latest available versions. Documentation may contain references to Qt 5.0 - please see known issues list at: https://sailfishos.org/wiki/SDK_Alpha_Qt5_Known_Issues.

Build Engine:
* Shadow building creates separate build directories outside your project directory named build-PROJECTNAME-KITNAME-[Debug|Release]
* The RPM packages for your project are also created under the shadow build directory
* Build Engine will not treat missing qtc_ macros in spec file as fatal.

SailfishOS Emulator:
* Emulator software is updated to match Jolla Phone release 1.0.1-10 "Laadunjärvi".
* SSH login password for nemo user can be set with Developer settings in Settings application.
* Package repositories can be refreshed with Developer settings in Settings application.
* Icon sizes are matched to Harbour requirements.

SailfishOS Targets:
* Both i486 and ARM target builds based on updated Jolla baseline.

There have been a new update to the SailfishSDK. The new wizard for physical devices are especially welcome Smile
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Saturday, 14.Dec.2013 01:58    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Good news, thanks for posting.

However, I think I will hold on with the update at least until the device arrives. In the current SDK I have all the required (missing by default) modules installed in the build engine and emulator (location, positioning, systeminfo, nokia and osm plugins, etc.) and I don't want to go through installing all of them again (until I don't have the device and have to use the emulator)...

When I get the phone, it will be a good time to update the SDK, as instead of installed modules I will need to use dependencies in the yaml file, anyway, so getting rid of those installed modules will actually be useful to make sure that all dependencies are correct.
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Wednesday, 18.Dec.2013 02:18    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

If an application don't depend on C++, but only use QML(pyotherside is permitted too), it might help to develop on device, or on emulator.

On device I make this directory: /usr/share/org.ketiltest and this file: /usr/share/org.ketiltest/qml/org.ketiltest.qml . That file is the qml that loads initial page and cover page. I also have pages and cover inside that qml folder.

I have also have added a png-image in /usr/share/icons/hicolor/86x86/apps/org.ketiltest.png and a .desktop file in /usr/share/applications/org.ketiltest.desktop with this content:
Code:

[Desktop Entry]
Type=Application
X-Nemo-Application-Type=silica-qt5
Name=FileManager
#Icon=/usr/share/icons/hicolor/86x86/apps/org.ketiltest.png
Icon=org.ketiltest
Exec=FileManager


Because I have given the device/emulator ip-adress 192.168.1.55 I can from a linux-computer mount this directory with this command(remember to mkfs filemanager-python first):
Code:
sshfs nemo@192.168.1.55:/usr/share/org.ketiltest/ filemanager-python


This makes it possible to edit the qml directly and relaunch from icon, ssh to nemo-user or from terminal. Using ssh or terminal I write sailfish-qml org.ketiltest and don't need desktop file.

I learned this trick by looking at the source code of gPodder by thomas perl. Prefer that over redeploying all the time(and don't need the Mer SDK running). I do however have a .pro file so QtCreator understand the structure of the project.

It can probably be done by using virtualbox's shared folder functionality too when using emulator, but haven't tried that.
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo Forum Index -> Jolla Sailfish OS All times are GMT + 2 Hours

Go to page
Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Page 4 of 4

 
Jump to:  
View previous topic :: View next topic

Similar Topics on this forum
Topic Author Forum Replies Posted
No new posts Sailfish OS SDK version 1707 released BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 1 Wednesday, 02.Aug.2017 15:29 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS 2.1.1 Jämsänjoki BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 3 Wednesday, 02.Aug.2017 15:00 View latest post
No new posts INOI R7 with Sailfish OS BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 1 Thursday, 06.Jul.2017 15:48 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish China consortium BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 2 Monday, 27.Feb.2017 17:17 View latest post
No new posts Sony Xperia devices with Sailfish OS BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 102 Monday, 27.Feb.2017 16:19 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS 2.1.0 Iijoki BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 3 Wednesday, 08.Feb.2017 18:20 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS achieves official status in Russia BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 5 Sunday, 04.Dec.2016 16:41 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS 2.0.5 Haapajoki BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 1 Tuesday, 22.Nov.2016 19:23 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS SDK version 1609 released BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 1 Monday, 10.Oct.2016 12:28 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS 2.0.4 Fiskarsinjoki BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 2 Monday, 26.Sep.2016 12:51 View latest post

Posting/discussing/exchanging warez/cracks/serial numbers/links to web sites offering such resources and/or any other illegal content
is FORBIDDEN on this forum and results in an immediate BAN.


Symbian and all Symbian-based marks and logos are trade marks of Symbian Software Limited.
This website is not in any way endorsed or supported by Symbian Software Limited.    (C) 2001 My-Symbian.com All Rights Reserved