SYMBIAN OS SECTION
  -My-Symbian.com-
MAEMO  SECTION
-My-Maemo.com-
MEEGO  SECTION
-My-MeeGo.com-
SOFTWARE STORECONTACT


My-Symbian.com Forums

 
My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo
Symbian & Linux based Communicator and Smartphone Info Center
The Oldest Symbian Community Website - Since 1999
 
 Watched TopicsWatched Topics   FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RulesRules   Log inLog in 
Lightweight, simplified version of the forumsMobile version
The Jolla starts shipping on November 27

Go to page  
1, 2, 3 ... 11, 12, 13  Next

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo Forum Index -> Jolla Sailfish OS
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Friday, 15.Nov.2013 19:34    Post subject: The Jolla starts shipping on November 27   Reply with quote   

Jolla has just announced that the phone will start shipping on..... November 27, i.e. in 12 days.

Yet there are still no developer units for native developers. If someone knows any better explanation for this other than that native software development isn't important and Android compatibility is top priority, please tell me.
Back to top
emunator
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 13 Nov 2002

Posts: 183

Thanks received:
6 in 6 posts
Thanks given: 4

Location: Finland
Phone: N8, N9

PostPosted: Friday, 15.Nov.2013 20:27    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

There was some news on finnish news paper that 27th is for some of the pre-orders, (around 450 or so) in some shop in Helsinki. Rest of the pre-orders soon after and in general start of december.
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Friday, 15.Nov.2013 22:05    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

There was some news on finnish news paper that 27th is for some of the pre-orders, (around 450 or so) in some shop in Helsinki. Rest of the pre-orders soon after and in general start of december.

The more it is suprising why ship as insignificant number of units (that doesn't really change anything) to a handful of end users rather than developers, who in exchange would deliver hundreds of native applications for the phone's launch.

I mean, if I have 10 applications for Sailfish OS which only need some on-device testing to be ready to be published, and if there surely are other developers like me with similar number of applications made/ported to Sailfish OS and just waiting for the possibility of on-device testing, by delivering at least part of this batch to such developers Jolla might get HUNDREDS native applications before the phone starts shipping in normal quantities.

Otherwise, I CAN NOT publish my applications until I can test them on a real device, because in the emulator I cannot test (nor even see if it works at all) any sensors, GPS, camera, LED, flash, vibration.... actually ANY hardware features, and I won't risk releasing potentially not working stuff.

If I got the device, I could also launch http://my-jolla.com with extensive review and Software Catalogue, i.e. start providing the device with free promotion.

Therefore, I don't understand why delivering the phone to a handful of end users ("in some shop in Helsinki", as you wrote) is more important for Jolla than allowing hundreds of native applications to be quickly tested and released (rather than launching the phone with JUST Android software), and some blogs and websites to start providing the platform with free promotion it so badly needs.

In the past I was getting replies from Marc Dillon (and was promised to get a developer sample to test my apps and to launch the site), but now I only get 'delivery confirmations'.
Back to top
naytsyrhc
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 21 Sep 2006

Posts: 911

Thanks received:
43 in 43 posts
Thanks given: 115

Location: Hamburg, Germany
Phone: History [/// R380s, SE P800, SE P910i, SE M600i, Nokia E71, Nokia N9, Jolla 1], Current [Sony Xperia X Compact SFOS]

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 01:31    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Maybe they don't do it by intention, maybe all this 'mess' is just there because they are unable to organise/plan an extra release of units for developers before real launch and they just want to be on schedule. And all that is maybe because of a tight schedule and because they're a small company. But it's somewhat strange indeed.

But besides that, it's really great news, that it is only 12 days until the release Very Happy
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 03:07    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

Maybe they don't do it by intention, maybe all this 'mess' is just there because they are unable to organise/plan an extra release of units for developers before real launch and they just want to be on schedule. And all that is maybe because of a tight schedule and because they're a small company. But it's somewhat strange indeed.

I don't know what "on schedule" means in their case as they never promised to start shipping on November 27. They were always saying "by the end of the year", so they're actually quite far AHEAD of their schedule and therefore they could have easily delivered that first batch (or even just part of it) to developers, and start public shipments a week later, if they only wanted so and cared to have any decent number of native applications at launch. And it still would have been 'on schedule', or actually still ahead of it.

Apparently, it is their choice not to provide any developer units, and yet another confirmation to me that native software is of much less importance for them than Android compatibility they talk about all the time.

Let's compare it with e.g. Canonical's upcoming Ubuntu: the store is available already now for both free and paid apps (native only), the SDK is available, and even the firmware has been released for free download and made compatible with Nexus 4 phones which one can buy cheaply second-hand and test software on a real device instantly. That's how it is supposed to look like in case of a company that SERIOUSLY treats those who want to support it.

Jolla is a small company, that's right. But people like me are not huge wealthy businesses, either. I am an individual, and it also takes me time, effort and expenses. If I decide to support one platform then I cannot support some other, because I am just one person with obvious human restrictions. If that platform turns out to be making impossible for me to develop and release my software then I end up with NOTHING. It really isn't an exaggeration to expect knowing when commercial software will be supported, when (or if at all) any developer units will be offered, and if they ever plan to focus on native software. Or else I will eventually have to switch to a platform like Ubuntu or Tizen where at least EVERYTHING IS CLEAR.
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 07:56    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

I believe a lot of those preorders are power users and developers that will contribute to the experience. I mean people paying 40€ or 100€ get priority over all others and the first to pay 40€ and 100€ were eager and trusting. They want Jolla to succeed. They want a good community. They want a phone they want to use. I am not sure if developers in general are more important than loyal users. Sure loyal developers are great and will help very much, but how do you know if the developers are loyal? Only by making it challenging for them and they still stick with it. I believe in some degree of challenge, but I tend to agree that the challenges are greater than they should have been.

They are a startup company with limited funding and don't have all too much experience managing everything themselves. I think most of them are engineers who worked in a team and they only had to convince their own about the project. Convincing your own is different from convincing others, not sure how much, or if it's more or less difficult, but sure needs at least slightly different skills. Jolla are also marketing and other stuff. Making all that fit together is something engineers probably aren't used to. They want and should have some control, but very hard saying how much the engineering side should have. The market does not work in a way that ensures the best technological product wins all the time. It does not work in order to make the most flexible product win either. It's a difficult challenge finding the correct balance.

I have written a 1180 words(over 2 a4-pages) long post explaining why I like jolla, and why they are slightly covering why they are better than android, but I need to think whether that fits in any existing thread and if the whole post is interesting before I post it. As it's so long it probably need some editing too. Probably better extending and integrate into a series of blog posts.
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 09:43    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

I believe a lot of those preorders are power users and developers that will contribute to the experience. I mean people paying 40€ or 100€ get priority over all others and the first to pay 40€ and 100€ were eager and trusting. They want Jolla to succeed. They want a good community. They want a phone they want to use.

Everyone wants Jolla to succeed. Wasn't I eager and trusting when I started porting my apps to Sailfish OS already in February 2013, before almost anyone else? Please check the date of this thread - I had SunCalc for Sailfish OS fully ported already on March 2nd. It was so early that even Jolla noticed it and included SunCalc in the demo of their phone (there's a video from Marc Dillon's demonstration showing it somewhere on this forum). Wasn't that a contribution to the platform? I've been supporting it since its very beginning.

Now I have TEN applications (usable, liked and positively rated by Symbian, Harmattan and BB10 users), not just ported but fully polished and with Jolla unique features added (active covers, etc.), which only need some quick tests to make sure everything (that cannot be tested in the emulator) works OK, and after that can be released anytime, which I think also is quite a worthwhile contribution to the platform.

Please also note when this Jolla forum was launched - October 2, 2012, almost 14 months ago. It was probably the FIRST discussion forum launched for the platform.

So, haven't I proved in multiple ways that I want to strongly support the platform? Haven't I started contributing to it long before it was known it would ever turn into an actual product, and long before it could provide any revenue? Haven't I proved during the previous 14 years how enthusiastically and loyally I support platforms I run my sites for? Can you name any other individual who has been running a website like this for 14 years - daily - and during that time managed to make it as popular as 60,000+ visitors a day, a whopping TWO MILLION visits a month? And who got as prestigious collection of awards for what the site was providing as honorary "Symbian Ltd. Affiliate Partner", "UIQ Technology Partner" and "S60 Evangelist Award for the biggest impact on public access to information about the Symbian platform" this site got?

I feel I could repeat that success once again with the Jolla, and THAT'S what for I need as early access to the phone as possible - to instantly start promoting it on this site. To continue contributing to it.

Guess what, I don't even get answers to my emails. Just like I never got any response to multiple offers of voluntary help I sent. I wanted to help with betatesting the device (and I really could do it well, I was doing it in the past for UIQ phones and Communicators), to prepare Polish translations of the UI and documentation (I made Polish localization for UIQ 2.x phones), and actually everything else. For free, to support the platform. No one needed it.

--

Back to your post, I do not know who those people who preordered the phone are: just end users, or developers. I don't think Jolla knows it, either, as I don't remember such detail having been requested in the pre-order form.

What I know, however, is that in case of any other platform since GEOS in 1996 or so, a small initial batch was always provided to most active developers and supporters first, and that's for an OBVIOUS reason: so that the phone could launch with some applications and publicity, rather than none. Of which end users and the platform itself could only benefit.

Quote:

I am not sure if developers in general are more important than loyal users.

I guess that no one here, and surely not I, ever said that developers are "more important". I am only saying that developers are REQUIRED for the platform to have its own native software. If they get the phone, IN EXCHANGE they will provide applications, and that is what the platform (and its USERS) need, especially at its launch, when everyone looks at it.

Why Jolla has chosen to launch the platform without any native software is beyond me - no one else ever did such a thing. And that's while people like me have a MULTITUDE of applications, just waiting for possibility to quickly test them and make them available. What a bummer.

Quote:

but how do you know if the developers are loyal?

What kind of question is that? It is simple: I have 10 applications which only need some tests. I could release all of them THIS WEEKEND if I only could test them. I can't because I will probably have to wait many weeks for the phone. What sense does it make while the platform badly needs native applications? None whatsoever.

Same for the site: while it still has thousands of visits, if I could quickly publish an extensive review and other content, it would give the phone a good free massive promotion. Just like my early (probably the first published) N900 preview which got so popular in 2009 (10 million views) that even Nokia managers were sending me congratulations. Similarly, the E90 Communicator review (also the first ever published) a couple years earlier. I proved many times that if I only have an early access to a device, my review gives it ENOURMOUS promotion.

For some reason in case of Jolla I am not wanted to repeat it as they prefer to deliver the phone to a handful of individuals rather than those who might feed the platform with applications and provide it with massive promotion.

P.S. And what do you mean by "loyal users"? You mean those hundreds of millions who dumped Symbian within the first couple of months after it was proclaimed as discontinued, the biggest exodus ever?


Last edited by Michal Jerz on Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 17:36; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
naytsyrhc
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 21 Sep 2006

Posts: 911

Thanks received:
43 in 43 posts
Thanks given: 115

Location: Hamburg, Germany
Phone: History [/// R380s, SE P800, SE P910i, SE M600i, Nokia E71, Nokia N9, Jolla 1], Current [Sony Xperia X Compact SFOS]

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 11:33    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Well spoken Michal. And you're right that it's not so difficult to spare part of those first devices released on 27th of November for developers. On the other hand, they still don't have their store ready for commercial apps.
Back to top
SamKB
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 11 Nov 2011

Posts: 627

Thanks received:
65 in 44 posts
Thanks given: 1


Phone: N9

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 17:21    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Michal is certainly correct. Without native apps to show off the unique features of the Sailfish os there is no good reason for users to buy a Jolla phone. If users want to run Android apps they will just get an Android device.

Jolla should learn from BB10 in order not to suffer the same fate. A beautiful os and Android compatibility (which can never be 100%) isn't helping BB10 succeed. If users see that the majority of apps they need will have to come Android they prefer to buy an Android phone, enuff said.

At best Android compatibility should be a temporary crutch to give Jolla time to get native apps up to speed. But the solution is also the problem because Android compatibility give little incentive for developers to develop native apps for Sailfish.

A better option would be to have Harmattan app compatibility out of the box as there is already a pool of good Harmattan apps which should hold the fort for a while. The Jolla phone will also be seen as an upgrade path for N9 users which may number in the millions.

Sadly, in its present course I see very little chance for Jolla to succeed. Using yesterday's hardware specs also doesn't help. I wish Jolla the best but I'm not sure that one year from now it will still be around.
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 19:00    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

Well spoken Michal. And you're right that it's not so difficult to spare part of those first devices released on 27th of November for developers.

Especially that with around ~47 people on the developer mailinglist active in November, it would only take 1/9th of that batch of 450 devices to cover them ALL, with 400 devices still left, which would make no difference at all.

Quote:

On the other hand, they still don't have their store ready for commercial apps.

Well, everything can be subject to discussion if one only cares. If anyone ever showed any interest in my apps, I might release some of them for free, just to support the platform. Or make slightly less featured free "Lite" versions. Or whatever else. Heck, I'd probably feel honoured if I was proposed to offer one of my apps so that it could ship preinstalled, like it is often the case on other platforms where phones ship with a bundle of preinstalled apps. I might e.g. "sacrifice" SunCalc for this, and make SunCalc Premium a paid upgrade. But no one ever showed any kind of interest, I couldn't even get information about my Sailfish OS ports retweeted as they were fully focused on the T-shirt soap opera.

Anyway, that the platform launches without possibility to sell commercial native apps is simply yet another unprecedented phenomenon, and a sign of how low native development (compared to Android compatibility) must have been on their priority list. Yet I still accept even that (with the usual "it is a small company" explanation), but the way that even just a VERY ROUGH ESTIMATION (a month? a year?) about when it may happen isn't given becomes really troublesome, because the same way as how we are supposed to understand that Jolla is a small company, Jolla should also understand that majority of developers supporting it at the moment are mainly individuals who do it for living. It has to work both ways.

Quote:

They are a startup company with limited funding and don't have all too much experience managing everything themselves.

Just to be precise, Jolla Ltd. is now a 200 million € ($259 million) alliance, as they announced themselves in October. $259 million is JUST ~ 18 times less than what the mighty RIM was ready to sell itself for (with all their assets, technology, patents, brand value, etc.).

Long story short, I think it is enough to hire one or two good business advisors if they really find themselves "not having too much experience to manage everything themselves". It's not an irony, I really mean it. If they don't have the required skills, they really better get someone who does, or else - as I wrote - this highly competitive market just won't forgive them that "let's learn on our mistakes and get better with time" approach. Their users and developers will, but THE COMPETITION won't.


==========

Anyway, back to the original topic: all I want to do is to support the platform with my apps (as much as 10 already now), and quickly launch a site to promote it (with all my previous sites - before the platforms were killed - having been highly successful). Neither of which I can do without access to the device. That's all.
Back to top
naytsyrhc
Site supporter
Site supporter



Joined: 21 Sep 2006

Posts: 911

Thanks received:
43 in 43 posts
Thanks given: 115

Location: Hamburg, Germany
Phone: History [/// R380s, SE P800, SE P910i, SE M600i, Nokia E71, Nokia N9, Jolla 1], Current [Sony Xperia X Compact SFOS]

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 21:34    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

I just read the press release at slush http://www.slush.org/2013/11/jolla/ and I think I now have an idea, why Jolla is acting as they do. First I think, they want to fulfil their promises they may have given to DNA. Maybe they even do more than expected by DNA themselves, certainly more than the contract says I presume. Secondly I think they just decided at some point what their definitions of done are. And they obviously decided it to be the device itself, the OS and the readiness to ship. As they promoted Android compatibility, they had to have that on board too and then adding a store to offer plenty of apps right on the start was a simple task. Probably much simpler and cheaper then a developer program with much greater impact on available apps count at start. I think maybe there was even an internal discussion about it, the outcome we can see now. And even if you, Michal, disagree, maybe the decision is not that bad at all. They now are really able to attract some current Android users that didn't change yet because they fear losing their currently used apps. Of course there is a great risk following this path, but there are always risks out there.

The only thing that MUST be done now by Jolla is, to start a decent developers program right after the launch and sale of the first devices. They MUST offer support for paid apps in store as soon as possible. And they really really should communicate to the community and/or the developers what they are planning to do for native apps. This I think is the biggest mistake anyway (rather my thoughts have something in common with reality or not).
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Saturday, 16.Nov.2013 23:20    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:

Back to your post, I do not know who those people who preordered the phone are: just end users, or developers. I don't think Jolla knows it, either, as I don't remember such detail having been requested in the pre-order form.

I really don't see why first preorder first serve is a problem. Builtin applications and features are much more important than third party developers.

Quote:

I guess that no one here, and surely not I, ever said that developers are "more important". I am only saying that developers are REQUIRED for the platform to have its own native software. If they get the phone, IN EXCHANGE they will provide applications, and that is what the platform (and its USERS) need, especially at its launch, when everyone looks at it.

If developers require a phone in exchange they are not really loyal, they are demanding. On the other hand as you say, you have ported 10 applications without getting any phone in return, I will call loyalty. I just don't think app developers should receive units early just because they are third party developers. For the lack of any good key to prioritize, first come first serve will have to be good enough.

iPhone without third party applications did not stop it for getting a large store for third party applications later. Maybe it's harder now than then, but sure not impossible.
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Sunday, 17.Nov.2013 03:48    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

naytsyrhc,

Whatever their strategy is, I'm sure that it would be MUCH easier to understand and accept for everyone if only there was ANY sort of communication with developers. If they decided to launch the phone this way, FINE, if only at the same time they at least communicated in any way (e.g. on the mailinglist) to developers what are their future plans regarding native development. Like e.g. "We're launching the phone this way now, but please expect an extensive support for native development to come next month". As simple thing as that would change it completely.

Similarly, if they don't plan to offer any developer units, a simple information would at least make it clear. Something like "we're sorry, but due to (whatever reason) we are unable to offer developer units at this point. Please hold on until your pre-ordered unit reaches you". As simple as that. Especially that a month ago I was told that I am "on the list" and I will get one, so I've been waiting only for what I've been TOLD, and if plans have changed then I'd expect to be told it.

The truth is that we know nothing, and we never really knew much. Since the beginning it's been a policy of disclosing AS LITTLE AS POSSIBLE, or less. And THAT'S exactly what's been causing all the confusion and disappointment, for many months. Proper information would have prevented ALL of it.

I really can understand e.g. that they need more time to allow distribution of paid software. But I really need to know, at least very roughly, how much it may take - a month, a year? I can wait a month, or two, but I CAN'T wait a year. Not because I "wish so" but simply because life of an individual developer of smartphone software (especially for tiny platforms like Harmattan or Jolla) REALLY ISN'T that great and profitable, and one simply cannot wait eternally while not earning anything, especially now that Nokia closes their store for N9 and Symbian apps. Many Qt developers are now in a really tough situation, having to make quite an important choice of which platform to develop for. It's often a matter of what their kids will eat in the future.

Jolla needs to understand that majority of those who decided support the platform are small teams or individuals, not fat and wealthy corporations. While we really try to understand and accept all the limitations resulting from Jolla being a small and fresh initiative, it has to work both ways and we (small individual developers) also deserve (and need) being at least properly informed about their plans, simply because it often affects our lives.

First I spent time on porting my software to Qt4.8/FWVGA. Then I learned it's going to be different. Then I waited 7 months to get the actual specifications and a further month for the updated SDK. Then I re-ported everything once again. And just after I finished doing it, I was told that there will be no support for paid apps until "in the future". And then they announced a commercial Android store instead. It really makes things tough for a developer like me.

If Jolla does not dislose any further details in the near future about how they are going to support native development and when they will start accepting commercial apps, many individual developers may be FORCED to switch to another platform, for purely EXISTENTIAL reasons, and not because they "feel like doing so".
Back to top
Michal Jerz
Admin/Founder/Owner
Admin/Founder/Owner



Joined: 01 Sep 1999

Posts: 29445

Thanks received:
1096 in 698 posts
Thanks given: 286

Location: Poland
Phone: Jolla, BB Z10, BB Passport, N950, N900, N8, Nexus 4 (Ubuntu Touch), Lumia 920

PostPosted: Sunday, 17.Nov.2013 04:48    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Ketlik,

Quote:

Builtin applications and features are much more important than third party developers.

Interesting how you can say it without really knowing what applications are built-in.

Quote:

If developers require a phone in exchange they are not really loyal, they are demanding.

It is OBVIOUS that a phone is required for the developer to be able to release his applications, or else how do you suppose him to test them? The way the emulator in the SDK currently works does not make it possible to test any hardware features (like sensors, GPS, camera, LED, flash, vibration, NFC, Bluetooth, etc.) nor even check if they work at all.

Or are you expecting developers to release half-baked, untested software that will then f**k up your phone and wipe your data, or in the best case eat 95% of battery in 20 minutes leaving you without a working phone when you need to make an important phone call.

And by "in exchange" I OBVIOUSLY meant that if a developer gets the phone then it will ALLOW him to release his applications, i.e. contribute to the platform and its users, while if an end user gets the phone then he will just USE it, i.e. NOT contribute to the platform. I thought it was obvious, but apparently not.

Quote:

On the other hand as you say, you have ported 10 applications without getting any phone in return, I will call loyalty.

Just to make it clear, I *NEVER* said that I expect to get the developer unit FOR FREE or that anyone else should get it so. I am ready to pay for it its normal, full price. I just want to get it early, so that I can release my apps and launch the site without further delays, i.e. start contributing to the platform and finally doing anything rather than still wasting time. Absolutely nothing to do with any "trade" or "exchange".

Quote:

I just don't think app developers should receive units early just because they are third party developers.

In other words, you are saying that every new platform should always launch WITHOUT ABSOLUTELY ANY NATIVE 3rd PARTY SOFTWARE, or else where would it come from if no 3rd party developers had access to devices before the platform lauches.

No offense intended but what an INSANE idea is this!

Quote:

iPhone without third party applications did not stop it for getting a large store for third party applications later.

You forgot about one FUNDAMENTAL difference: the iPhone wasn't Android (or anything else) compatible, so users HAD NO CHOICE but to wait, and when the store was eventually launched it was still THE FIRST and THE ONLY store and thus it attracted everyone.

The situation on Jolla is totally different due to its Android compatibility: the longer it takes to start to offer native software the more the platform will get SATURATED by Android software instead. No one will refuse to use Android apps and just wait with an empty phone until "in the future" native applications come.
Back to top
Ketilk
Site supporter
Site supporter

Please add your avatar!

Joined: 19 Dec 2011

Posts: 514

Thanks received:
50 in 45 posts
Thanks given: 6


Phone: Sony Xperia XA(Android 7.0), Jolla, N9 , N900, N97-mini,

PostPosted: Sunday, 17.Nov.2013 12:57    Post subject:   Reply with quote   

Quote:
In other words, you are saying that every new platform should always launch WITHOUT ABSOLUTELY ANY NATIVE 3rd PARTY SOFTWARE, or else where would it come from if no 3rd party developers had access to devices before the platform lauches.

No offense intended but what an INSANE idea is this!

I really wouldn't have minded a beta-image on top of nemo, but for every software they distribute they need to be able to distribute the source code for free and open source software they use and I believe they are not prepared to do that yet. Not sure if they have a license for distributing sillica components and such with a proprietary license, depends on whether they bought commercial Qt license or not I think.

I see it as either they go public 27. November or they do a pre-launch event for specific groups of people around 27. November and delay the public release longer. It will be limited availability a while yet, so not everyone can get the phone at launch, only some preorders and some DNA customers.

I don't approve the decision of let DNA customers in early, but I approve of letting in preorders early.
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    My-Symbian ~ My-Maemo ~ My-MeeGo Forum Index -> Jolla Sailfish OS All times are GMT + 2 Hours

Go to page  
1, 2, 3 ... 11, 12, 13  Next
Page 1 of 13

 
Jump to:  
View previous topic :: View next topic

Similar Topics on this forum
Topic Author Forum Replies Posted
No new posts Spam from Jolla Michal Jerz Jolla Sailfish OS 6 Wednesday, 28.Jun.2017 03:15 View latest post
No new posts Jolla in 2017 BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 57 Wednesday, 08.Feb.2017 17:43 View latest post
No new posts Jolla secures new financing for Sailfish OS development BentL Jolla Sailfish OS 1 Tuesday, 03.May.2016 11:17 View latest post
No new posts Jolla Adventures Kleuter Jolla Sailfish OS 0 Friday, 13.Nov.2015 19:30 View latest post
No new posts First wave of Jolla tablets arrive, further delay for rest Casanunda Jolla Sailfish OS 13 Friday, 09.Oct.2015 17:23 View latest post
No new posts What is Jolla up to? MeowTseDong Jolla Sailfish OS 5 Friday, 21.Aug.2015 21:48 View latest post
No new posts Jolla splitting into two companies and changing management N/A Jolla Sailfish OS 69 Wednesday, 08.Jul.2015 09:36 View latest post
No new posts What are those partnerships of Jolla in fact? Kleuter Jolla Sailfish OS 35 Saturday, 25.Apr.2015 13:55 View latest post
No new posts Sailfish OS 2.0 & Jolla Tablet on MWC Casanunda Jolla Sailfish OS 15 Tuesday, 03.Mar.2015 23:11 View latest post
No new posts The blog from Marc Dillon about the Jolla plans for 2015 spyder81 Jolla Sailfish OS 10 Monday, 26.Jan.2015 15:55 View latest post

Posting/discussing/exchanging warez/cracks/serial numbers/links to web sites offering such resources and/or any other illegal content
is FORBIDDEN on this forum and results in an immediate BAN.


Symbian and all Symbian-based marks and logos are trade marks of Symbian Software Limited.
This website is not in any way endorsed or supported by Symbian Software Limited.    (C) 2001 My-Symbian.com All Rights Reserved